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146 2017-05-19T11:40:00  <karelb> reposting question from #bitcoin - how exactly is fee/byte calculated for segwit transactions with respect to mining and which transaction will miner take into block
147 2017-05-19T11:40:07  <karelb> if miner is running bitcoin-core
148 2017-05-19T11:40:36  <karelb> I am writing a wallet software and I am not sure if fee is calculated from the whole tx, or only the "non-segwit" parts
149 2017-05-19T11:49:52  <conman> effectively the block contribution size
150 2017-05-19T11:51:51  <instagibbs> karelb, so for fee estimation you won't be relaying segwit tx if you're not a segwit node
151 2017-05-19T11:51:57  <instagibbs> thus you wont be estimating them
152 2017-05-19T11:52:07  <instagibbs> so you'll just be estimating non-segwit tx feerate
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157 2017-05-19T12:07:22  <karelb> instagibbs: but I will be segwit node?
158 2017-05-19T12:08:02  <karelb> Also in source I see ModifiedSize and TransactionWeight (in primitives/transaction.cpp) and I am not sure what those are for
159 2017-05-19T12:10:50  <karelb> it seems it gets used in txmempool for something :)
160 2017-05-19T12:11:26  <conman> weight replaces size
161 2017-05-19T12:12:26  <conman> when determining fee ratio; i.e. it will be fee/weight instead of fee/size
162 2017-05-19T12:13:18  <karelb> oh, that seems important for fee estimation :D
163 2017-05-19T12:16:38  <karelb> So the result of RPC calls estimatefee will return fee/weight, ok
164 2017-05-19T12:16:54  <karelb> oh I see it in here
165 2017-05-19T12:17:00  <karelb> "Uses virtual transaction size of transaction as defined in BIP 141 (witness data is discounted)."
166 2017-05-19T12:17:10  <conman> traditional transactions are basically 4x size = weight
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168 2017-05-19T12:19:33  <karelb> oh. ok. ooooh BIP 141 defines all that
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170 2017-05-19T12:21:44  <karelb> hm. ok. I am maintaining right now bitcore/insight with segwit (since bitpay abandoned it), and I *think* it displays the size, and the fees, wrong (on segwit txs)
171 2017-05-19T12:22:09  <karelb> I *think* it displays the total size on the segwit txs and counts fee/kb from that
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175 2017-05-19T12:35:51  <instagibbs> karelb, that's likely unless you replaced the equiv of GetTransactionSize
176 2017-05-19T12:38:36  <karelb> nope, I didn't touch that since I didn't realize that
177 2017-05-19T12:39:55  <karelb> Is there a way to get tx weight by RPC?
178 2017-05-19T12:40:00  <karelb> Or at least by some online tool :D
179 2017-05-19T12:41:01  <karelb> decoderawtransaction shows size
180 2017-05-19T12:41:15  <karelb> oooh it shows vsize also
181 2017-05-19T12:41:17  <karelb> great
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185 2017-05-19T12:55:07  <instagibbs> vsize is slightly different from weight, but you should be able to get weight as well
186 2017-05-19T12:58:06  <instagibbs> "size" should be exactly what you need from that rpc call for a segwit-aware node
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205 2017-05-19T15:05:19  <garit> In bitcoin channel web of trust is used on a website.is there any similar service that i could use online? (To make my small web of trust with friends)
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216 2017-05-19T16:18:24  <JuanDaugherty> http://bitcoinstats.com/irc/bitcoin-dev/logs/2017/05 appears broken, or does it lag by some days?
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218 2017-05-19T16:22:42  <cdecker> JuanDaugherty, sometimes my logging bot is unable to auth and hence can't join
219 2017-05-19T16:22:50  <cdecker> I try to fix it once I notice it
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221 2017-05-19T16:24:51  <JuanDaugherty> ah, #sidechains-dev seem to have similar issues but i think may be just low activity there. In any case it's central to context flow in publicly logged channels that people can see what they're entering
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223 2017-05-19T16:30:08  <cdecker> I'm not logging that
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239 2017-05-19T19:30:07  <Iriez> Can miners construct an  O(n2) malicous block without it being valid? And would changing " if (::GetSerializeSize(tx, SER_NETWORK, PROTOCOL_VERSION) > MAX_BLOCK_SIZE)" require a HF? Curious if limiting transaction size at all is an effective solution to the problem?
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251 2017-05-19T20:34:16  <Chris_Stewart_5> arubi: Let's move it over here since you are in this channel
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253 2017-05-19T20:34:47  <arubi> sure, better
254 2017-05-19T20:34:52  <Chris_Stewart_5> So I am calling funrawtransaction with a presigned input and the tx has two outputs *before* calling fundrawtx
255 2017-05-19T20:35:03  <arubi> alright
256 2017-05-19T20:35:06  <Chris_Stewart_5> I want to use fundrawtransaction to add a input for a fee
257 2017-05-19T20:35:24  <Chris_Stewart_5> as the presigned input and two outputs are *exact* values -- i.e. there is no fee yet.
258 2017-05-19T20:35:29  <arubi> okay, but the presigned one will becme invalid right
259 2017-05-19T20:35:38  <arubi> s/become
260 2017-05-19T20:35:51  <Chris_Stewart_5> Well I was looking at the sighash types to try and figure out what to use -- i'm trying to use SIGHASH_SINGLE right now but I don't think that is right
261 2017-05-19T20:35:54  <Chris_Stewart_5> since I have two outputs
262 2017-05-19T20:36:07  <arubi> it's possible, but not very safe
263 2017-05-19T20:36:32  <arubi> anyone could replace the second output
264 2017-05-19T20:36:55  <arubi> you'd want to sign the presigned input as ANYONECANPAY
265 2017-05-19T20:37:21  <Chris_Stewart_5> That doesn't protect *any* of the outputs though does it?
266 2017-05-19T20:37:30  <arubi> it protects all outputs
267 2017-05-19T20:37:36  <arubi> you wouldn't be able to add outputs at all
268 2017-05-19T20:37:55  <Chris_Stewart_5> well, isn't that problem because I would need to add a change output more than likely for a fee?
269 2017-05-19T20:37:59  <arubi> it just asserts a single input, and allows to add more wil no outputs
270 2017-05-19T20:38:08  <Chris_Stewart_5> unless I just happen to have a good utxo for change
271 2017-05-19T20:38:11  <arubi> right, then there's no simple way to do that without segwit
272 2017-05-19T20:38:41  <arubi> well, maybe there is one way
273 2017-05-19T20:39:21  <arubi> you could sign the presigned one as anyonecanpay|single with it being in index 1, and index 0 being blank
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275 2017-05-19T20:39:33  <arubi> then add the second input later at index 0
276 2017-05-19T20:40:13  <arubi> that would assert that there should be another input (whichever), and that there should be at least one output that the anyonecanpay|single input pays for
277 2017-05-19T20:40:31  <arubi> you'd have to make that single output at index 1 LESS than the input itself
278 2017-05-19T20:40:44  <arubi> so it's not worth stealing it
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280 2017-05-19T20:41:39  <arubi> so output 3 pays to the recipient, output 2 pays a change from input 1 and input 0 pays fee and change to output 0
281 2017-05-19T20:42:27  <arubi> off the top of my head, that should work :)  output 3 will only be signed by input 0
282 2017-05-19T20:43:21  <Chris_Stewart_5> Does there have to be a predetermined fee in output index 0 though?
283 2017-05-19T20:43:35  <arubi> nope
284 2017-05-19T20:43:36  <Chris_Stewart_5> or pre determined change for a fee in output index 0?
285 2017-05-19T20:43:53  <Chris_Stewart_5> also, doesn't that scheme with ANYONECANPAY|SINGLE not protect output at idnex 3?
286 2017-05-19T20:44:09  <arubi> yes, but it doesn't have to as input 0 does
287 2017-05-19T20:44:18  <arubi> input 0 can sign ALL
288 2017-05-19T20:44:37  <arubi> and unless anyone wants to pay for you, input 1 and output 1 as a paid is useless :)
289 2017-05-19T20:44:53  <arubi> a pair*
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291 2017-05-19T20:45:34  <Chris_Stewart_5> ah, so I protect the change I am paying to myself with SIGHASHANYONECANPAY|SINGLE -- and the receipients output is protected by the SIGHASH_ALL
292 2017-05-19T20:45:50  <arubi> right
293 2017-05-19T20:47:43  <Chris_Stewart_5> Ok, I think i follow and can't think of a way this would steal from some one off of the top of my head. How does segwit make that whole interaction easier?
294 2017-05-19T20:48:05  <arubi> with segwit, anyonecanpay|single does not commit to an index in a transacation
295 2017-05-19T20:48:43  <arubi> so the pair in itself can be presigned, stored, combined with other pairs, then signed finally with some ALL that pays for fees
296 2017-05-19T20:49:00  <Chris_Stewart_5> how is that different that NONE|ANYONECANPAY
297 2017-05-19T20:49:08  <Chris_Stewart_5> Oh, so it doesn't commit to an output, just not the index of that output
298 2017-05-19T20:49:16  <Chris_Stewart_5> it does* commit to an output
299 2017-05-19T20:49:33  <arubi> it commits to input index and no outputs
300 2017-05-19T20:50:13  <Chris_Stewart_5> wait, so the pair you are talking about is (input,indexIndex)? Not (input,output)?
301 2017-05-19T20:50:34  <arubi> no the pair is input,output
302 2017-05-19T20:50:57  <arubi> in non segwit, any input also commits to its index
303 2017-05-19T20:51:37  <arubi> in some way, even anyonecanpay because even though the input is the only one signed, the index is still committed to
304 2017-05-19T20:51:50  <arubi> so you have to have "at least" that many inputs
305 2017-05-19T20:53:39  <Chris_Stewart_5> Now if only segwit would activate... :P. Just to be clear, you think the 'fundrawtx' call I was making was because i used SIGHASH_SINGLE instead of SIGHASH_SINGLE|ANYONECANPAY?
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307 2017-05-19T20:54:45  <Chris_Stewart_5> since the input was presigned
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309 2017-05-19T20:54:57  <arubi> soon, if you run bip148 :) ,  I'm not sure, the error seems weird but from looking at traces this is the only thing I can think of
310 2017-05-19T20:55:14  <abpa> August 1 is still a ways off
311 2017-05-19T20:55:16  <arubi> and adding an input will invalidate the signature
312 2017-05-19T20:55:34  <Chris_Stewart_5> Yeah, i was looking at this issue from dooglus https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/7879
313 2017-05-19T20:55:37  <arubi> it is, hopefully more will be running the client by then.
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315 2017-05-19T20:56:03  <arubi> ah interesting
316 2017-05-19T20:56:09  <Chris_Stewart_5> but I think we might have different problems -- although I am using a watchonly address too
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319 2017-05-19T20:58:39  <arubi> if you have anything exotic to sign, it's usually better to use `bitcoin-tx`, but you don't get wallet access with that and need to use raw keys
320 2017-05-19T20:58:46  <arubi> (and prevtxs)
321 2017-05-19T21:02:04  <Chris_Stewart_5> Yeah I'm trying to use core for the boring things like adding change outputs/inputs. I'm gonna give implement your SIGHASH scheme latter. Thanks for the help
322 2017-05-19T21:04:42  <arubi> cheers
323 2017-05-19T21:07:24  <Chris_Stewart_5> instagibbs: Not all outputs have to be solvable to call 'fundrawtx' right? I think arubi and I concluded that it was probably breaking because I was using the wrong SIGHASH scheme
324 2017-05-19T21:12:48  <Chris_Stewart_5> asssuming that input for that output is presigned
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