1 2017-09-15T00:00:33 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
2 2017-09-15T00:02:24 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
3 2017-09-15T00:08:49 *** agricocb has quit IRC
4 2017-09-15T00:09:56 <lrvick> looks like I was confusing rpc calls from 0.10 docs. it is happy now
5 2017-09-15T00:11:37 <CryptAxe> yay!
6 2017-09-15T00:18:29 *** damons-away is now known as damons
7 2017-09-15T00:19:21 *** molz has joined #bitcoin-dev
8 2017-09-15T00:26:49 *** agricocb has joined #bitcoin-dev
9 2017-09-15T00:28:23 *** Murch has quit IRC
10 2017-09-15T00:31:40 *** BGL has joined #bitcoin-dev
11 2017-09-15T00:44:17 *** chainey has joined #bitcoin-dev
12 2017-09-15T00:53:52 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
13 2017-09-15T00:55:58 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
14 2017-09-15T00:58:50 *** dabura667 has joined #bitcoin-dev
15 2017-09-15T01:01:42 *** harrymm has quit IRC
16 2017-09-15T01:06:26 *** Agro has joined #bitcoin-dev
17 2017-09-15T01:12:56 *** dabura667 has quit IRC
18 2017-09-15T01:16:20 *** dabura667 has joined #bitcoin-dev
19 2017-09-15T01:52:53 *** pbase has joined #bitcoin-dev
20 2017-09-15T01:55:40 *** RubenSomsen has joined #bitcoin-dev
21 2017-09-15T01:58:25 *** harrymm has joined #bitcoin-dev
22 2017-09-15T02:04:34 *** fluidjax has quit IRC
23 2017-09-15T02:05:52 *** dabura667_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
24 2017-09-15T02:06:05 *** dabura667 has quit IRC
25 2017-09-15T02:18:22 *** subo_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
26 2017-09-15T02:22:01 *** subo has quit IRC
27 2017-09-15T02:22:45 *** justan0theruser has joined #bitcoin-dev
28 2017-09-15T02:35:41 *** Agro has quit IRC
29 2017-09-15T02:44:22 *** dviola has quit IRC
30 2017-09-15T02:52:56 *** harai_ has quit IRC
31 2017-09-15T03:05:37 *** remote has quit IRC
32 2017-09-15T03:09:20 *** jtimon has quit IRC
33 2017-09-15T03:14:48 *** justan0theruser has quit IRC
34 2017-09-15T03:28:46 *** justan0theruser has joined #bitcoin-dev
35 2017-09-15T03:34:46 *** harai_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
36 2017-09-15T03:36:54 *** Giszmo has quit IRC
37 2017-09-15T04:06:10 *** pbase has quit IRC
38 2017-09-15T04:21:35 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
39 2017-09-15T04:24:13 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
40 2017-09-15T04:32:30 *** iv3c has quit IRC
41 2017-09-15T04:36:16 *** harrymm has quit IRC
42 2017-09-15T04:40:01 *** jrick has quit IRC
43 2017-09-15T04:43:19 *** GypsyScotty has quit IRC
44 2017-09-15T04:56:42 *** TheSeven has quit IRC
45 2017-09-15T04:56:55 *** [7] has joined #bitcoin-dev
46 2017-09-15T04:57:22 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
47 2017-09-15T05:03:21 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
48 2017-09-15T05:04:41 *** paster has joined #bitcoin-dev
49 2017-09-15T05:06:10 *** YoY has quit IRC
50 2017-09-15T05:08:20 *** YoY has joined #bitcoin-dev
51 2017-09-15T05:08:26 *** licnep has quit IRC
52 2017-09-15T05:10:13 *** Murch has joined #bitcoin-dev
53 2017-09-15T05:11:08 *** joeyy has joined #bitcoin-dev
54 2017-09-15T05:18:58 *** pbase has joined #bitcoin-dev
55 2017-09-15T05:22:20 *** jrick has joined #bitcoin-dev
56 2017-09-15T05:26:35 *** BGL has quit IRC
57 2017-09-15T05:29:05 *** RubenSomsen has quit IRC
58 2017-09-15T05:59:18 *** Murch has quit IRC
59 2017-09-15T06:26:12 *** nazarewk has joined #bitcoin-dev
60 2017-09-15T06:26:32 *** POJO has joined #bitcoin-dev
61 2017-09-15T06:54:30 *** BGL has joined #bitcoin-dev
62 2017-09-15T06:56:00 *** POJO has quit IRC
63 2017-09-15T07:00:42 *** POJO has joined #bitcoin-dev
64 2017-09-15T07:07:29 *** Mottengrotte has joined #bitcoin-dev
65 2017-09-15T07:09:51 *** pbase has quit IRC
66 2017-09-15T07:10:14 *** Mottengrotte_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
67 2017-09-15T07:12:07 *** harai_ has quit IRC
68 2017-09-15T07:13:45 *** Mottengrotte has quit IRC
69 2017-09-15T07:15:36 *** pbase has joined #bitcoin-dev
70 2017-09-15T07:15:41 *** |Clown| has quit IRC
71 2017-09-15T07:26:24 *** DougieBot5000_ has quit IRC
72 2017-09-15T07:32:01 *** DougieBot5000 has joined #bitcoin-dev
73 2017-09-15T07:32:21 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
74 2017-09-15T07:33:35 *** |Clown| has joined #bitcoin-dev
75 2017-09-15T07:37:18 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
76 2017-09-15T07:43:27 *** Cocodude has joined #bitcoin-dev
77 2017-09-15T07:43:45 *** harrymm has joined #bitcoin-dev
78 2017-09-15T07:44:51 <Cocodude> Hey all. Just upgrading to v0.15 (good work btw), but there's one change you've put in that I don't like and I think it's not far off being a bug.
79 2017-09-15T07:45:14 <Cocodude> You now require that the wallet.dat file is a regular file, and don't allow it to be a symlink (Error: Error loading wallet wallet.dat. -wallet filename must be a regular file.)
80 2017-09-15T07:45:42 <Cocodude> And if I specify the real wallet in the -wallet command line, the client complains with "-wallet parameter must only specify a filename (not a path)"
81 2017-09-15T07:46:19 <Cocodude> This is a bit of a pain - I store the wallet on an encrypted partition so this now stops me from being able to do this effectively. Why was this change put in (especially the lack of love to symlinks)?
82 2017-09-15T07:47:12 *** chainey has quit IRC
83 2017-09-15T07:50:39 <esotericnonsense> i believe that it's to enforce locking semantics on the wallet file (it has always been necessary that the wallet file exist in the datadir and symlinking is a hack around that)
84 2017-09-15T07:50:58 <esotericnonsense> e.g. two bitcoin instances operating on the same wallet file would be bad news
85 2017-09-15T07:51:38 <Cocodude> Ah, yes, that would be bad
86 2017-09-15T07:51:54 *** chainey has joined #bitcoin-dev
87 2017-09-15T07:52:35 <Cocodude> I wish there was a way to override this check then I guess, but that sounds like a lot of work which only benefits people doing things in a special way, like me
88 2017-09-15T07:53:29 <Cocodude> I don't imagine I'm the only one doing this though - I don't want to keep the entire blockchain encrypted (it's not exactly a secret) but I want the wallet to be. It provides some security as everything important as I have encryption at rest.
89 2017-09-15T07:53:46 <Cocodude> I can't think of a neat way to do this any other way off the top of my head
90 2017-09-15T07:53:57 <arubi> how about having the datadir on the encrypted filesystem and symlink the big directories out?
91 2017-09-15T07:54:01 *** one_zero has quit IRC
92 2017-09-15T07:54:12 <esotericnonsense> i'm not sure why you wouldn't keep the blockchain encrypted, overhead is ~zero on modern CPUs
93 2017-09-15T07:54:13 <Cocodude> "neat way" :)
94 2017-09-15T07:54:25 <esotericnonsense> aesni is 3GB/sec per core
95 2017-09-15T07:54:31 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: Encrypted for me is also on a SSD as the wallet has a lot of I/O on it
96 2017-09-15T07:54:35 <Cocodude> And SSD space is limited
97 2017-09-15T07:55:00 <esotericnonsense> you could do it backwards and symlink blocks/chainstate ? :P
98 2017-09-15T07:55:09 <arubi> that's what I was suggesting :)
99 2017-09-15T07:55:14 <Cocodude> Yeah, it's possible, but even more ugly than just symlinking the wallet
100 2017-09-15T07:55:38 <esotericnonsense> arubi: sorry, didn't see that :P
101 2017-09-15T07:56:09 <Cocodude> arubi/esotericnonsense: It would work, I agree, but what happens when Bitcoin Core adds another special folder/file there that I don't really want on the SSD?
102 2017-09-15T07:56:36 <arubi> well like you said, it's a specialized setup. you'll have to adapt
103 2017-09-15T07:56:55 <Cocodude> Thinking about it again, do you think it really is that specialised?
104 2017-09-15T07:57:04 <Cocodude> Wallets do have a totally different security profile to the rest of the directory
105 2017-09-15T07:57:04 <esotericnonsense> i'm confused by 'wallet has a lot of IO on it' really, unless you're using it as a merchant and chucking many tx per second at it
106 2017-09-15T07:57:12 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: Guess what, I am!
107 2017-09-15T07:57:17 <esotericnonsense> :P
108 2017-09-15T07:57:17 <arubi> it does have a bunch of io
109 2017-09-15T07:57:28 <Cocodude> OK, not many per second, but often a few a minute
110 2017-09-15T07:57:43 <Cocodude> When a new block comes in, there's lots of fun that happens with wallet IO too
111 2017-09-15T07:57:43 *** harai_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
112 2017-09-15T07:57:52 <esotericnonsense> my understanding might be outdated but I believe that work done on wallet.dat can leak outside of the file anyway
113 2017-09-15T07:58:00 <esotericnonsense> only private keys are treated with care
114 2017-09-15T07:58:28 <Cocodude> That's the only security-critical thing though. If metadata or whatever spills out, then I can live with that (although I thought all that was in the wallet too)
115 2017-09-15T07:58:42 <arubi> it was, but only keys are encrypted
116 2017-09-15T07:58:46 <esotericnonsense> can you not use the built in encryption?
117 2017-09-15T07:58:47 <arubi> it is*
118 2017-09-15T07:59:13 <Cocodude> It's possible, but it's a lot neater all round to just have block encryption on a partition for me
119 2017-09-15T07:59:40 <arubi> wait, so it's unencrypted by itself?
120 2017-09-15T07:59:43 <Cocodude> Yes
121 2017-09-15T07:59:53 <arubi> and core is running, and it is loaded?
122 2017-09-15T08:00:01 <Cocodude> Yes
123 2017-09-15T08:00:07 <Cocodude> Now you're going to tell me that's a stupid thing to do... :/
124 2017-09-15T08:00:12 <arubi> not sure how encrypted filesystem helps?
125 2017-09-15T08:00:15 <esotericnonsense> Yes
126 2017-09-15T08:00:16 <Cocodude> Ah, phew :)
127 2017-09-15T08:00:17 <esotericnonsense> ;)
128 2017-09-15T08:00:25 <Cocodude> It helps as I have encryption at rest
129 2017-09-15T08:00:34 <Cocodude> Someone steals the server, I should be safe
130 2017-09-15T08:00:38 <arubi> yea, but the wallet is wide open all the time
131 2017-09-15T08:00:49 <Cocodude> Not if they've stolen the server and it's powered off or rebooted!
132 2017-09-15T08:00:56 <esotericnonsense> do you have encrypted swap? (now i'm just being an arse :P)
133 2017-09-15T08:00:59 <Cocodude> Or just taken out the HDDs or whatever
134 2017-09-15T08:01:01 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: Yes, I do
135 2017-09-15T08:01:04 <esotericnonsense> :D
136 2017-09-15T08:01:21 <arubi> yea if the pc turns off then it's encrypted, but most times it's not off
137 2017-09-15T08:01:44 <esotericnonsense> it might be better to ask this in #bitcoin-core-dev. the specific commit seems to be here: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/commit/a6da027d83e48f05c933149ff89c9b9ad5ced915#diff-b2bb174788c7409b671c46ccc86034bd
138 2017-09-15T08:02:02 <arubi> Cocodude, is that actually a hot wallet then?
139 2017-09-15T08:02:13 <Cocodude> arubi: Yes
140 2017-09-15T08:02:31 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: Thanks for pointing out the commit
141 2017-09-15T08:02:46 <arubi> I mean, hopefully larger funds are stored fully encrypted and offline right?
142 2017-09-15T08:02:56 <Cocodude> Yes, indeed
143 2017-09-15T08:02:59 <esotericnonsense> i suppose the easiest option if you're fully committed to doing this
144 2017-09-15T08:03:00 <Cocodude> I'm only on about the hot wallet
145 2017-09-15T08:03:02 <esotericnonsense> is to rip that out and recompile
146 2017-09-15T08:03:09 <arubi> alright, understood
147 2017-09-15T08:03:10 <esotericnonsense> but i'd try and work out if there's a good reason for it
148 2017-09-15T08:03:24 <arubi> yea I guess that's the best you can do in this case if the wallet is used for sending a lot
149 2017-09-15T08:03:29 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: Yeah, it would be trivial to just comment out a few lines, but it's only a very short term solution
150 2017-09-15T08:04:00 <Cocodude> arubi: Indeed. There can't be negligable funds in the hot wallet either as the amount needed in there fluctuates quite a bit).
151 2017-09-15T08:04:04 <esotericnonsense> if you're using rpc you can also just use the built in encryption and unlock it with walletpassphrase for an absurd amount of time, i'm not sure if there's an upper bound
152 2017-09-15T08:04:20 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: I need a new wallet as well for that
153 2017-09-15T08:04:32 <Cocodude> My wallet is, ehm, quite big in terms of size
154 2017-09-15T08:04:56 <arubi> I think multiwallet is in 0.15.0 ?
155 2017-09-15T08:05:10 <Cocodude> Yeah I think that would be helpful in migrating.
156 2017-09-15T08:05:23 <esotericnonsense> it should be doable, it'll just take a while, no? i'd be surprised if the enc/dec wasn't using aesni
157 2017-09-15T08:05:35 <Cocodude> There is some slowdown with my large wallet (takes a few seconds to send a tx) so some code core which is O(n) or similar
158 2017-09-15T08:06:10 <Cocodude> esotericnonsense: Doesn't stop the requirement to have the wallet on a SSD - the wallet really does appear to use a lot of I/O.
159 2017-09-15T08:06:22 <esotericnonsense> ah yeah, that's true
160 2017-09-15T08:06:37 *** ongolaBoy has joined #bitcoin-dev
161 2017-09-15T08:06:59 <esotericnonsense> well, wrt 'another special file/folder you don't really want on the SSD' and the symlinking blocks/chainstate approach
162 2017-09-15T08:07:22 <esotericnonsense> it seems like it would be obvious ahead of time if another large set of data is produced
163 2017-09-15T08:07:50 <esotericnonsense> e.g. chucking a few extra megs on the SSD doesn't seem to be that much of a problem, only if it's actually say, >1GB
164 2017-09-15T08:08:08 <Cocodude> That's true
165 2017-09-15T08:08:34 <Cocodude> It just feels a lot more messy. There's only one thing I want moved, so it seems nicer to move that one thing (rather than everything *but* that one thing)
166 2017-09-15T08:09:34 <arubi> well having peers.dat , mempool.dat, debug.log .. etc on the encrypted ssd will help with io and privacy if the pc is stolen
167 2017-09-15T08:09:37 <esotericnonsense> the entire contents of my .bitcoin folder aside from chainstate and blocks is about 15MB, you might have a bigger debug.log and mempool.dat could be a few meg i suppose
168 2017-09-15T08:09:43 <esotericnonsense> yes, that too
169 2017-09-15T08:09:48 <esotericnonsense> debug.log especially
170 2017-09-15T08:10:52 <esotericnonsense> having chainstate on SSD would probably improve performance too if you can spare the 3GB
171 2017-09-15T08:11:00 <esotericnonsense> depends on your dbcache setting
172 2017-09-15T08:11:02 <Cocodude> Yeah, just the chainstate, blocks and debug.log really shouldn't be on the SSD
173 2017-09-15T08:11:06 *** womantis has quit IRC
174 2017-09-15T08:11:10 <Cocodude> Hmm, good point about chainstate
175 2017-09-15T08:11:40 <Cocodude> Actually, I just use the default dbcache values. With the wallet on the SSD, I think I'm more CPU bound because the wallet is so huge.
176 2017-09-15T08:12:23 *** CheckDavid has joined #bitcoin-dev
177 2017-09-15T08:15:39 <Cocodude> Just thinking about this, all this commit does is to stop the wallet from being specified twice on the -wallet command line (one regular, one symlink to that file). I think that sounds like a more niche "security improvement" than my setup.
178 2017-09-15T08:15:49 <Cocodude> It wouldn't stop, for instance, two instances of Core running, both pointing to the same wallet
179 2017-09-15T08:16:12 <esotericnonsense> Cocodude: you can't run two copies of bitcoin from the same datadir without hacking
180 2017-09-15T08:16:43 <Cocodude> Oh yes, the -wallet has to be in the same datadir as you can't specify a path. Got it.
181 2017-09-15T08:16:51 <esotericnonsense> yes :P
182 2017-09-15T08:22:19 <Cocodude> I've added my comment to https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10885 so we'll see if it gets a response
183 2017-09-15T08:22:37 <Cocodude> This is going to be especially fun as other alts pick up on this and I need to shuffle everything around for Litecoin, Doge etc.
184 2017-09-15T08:25:53 *** nodweber has joined #bitcoin-dev
185 2017-09-15T08:26:40 <esotericnonsense> thinking about it, if that's the rationale (two wallet files symlinked to each other in the same instance), then it should be possible to determine that at startup, if a bit of a faff
186 2017-09-15T08:27:25 <esotericnonsense> it seems like there must be a way to determine if a file and a symlink point to the same file, if not, you could hash them both and compare (though i suppose with a large wallet that might take a while :P)
187 2017-09-15T08:27:27 *** DTZUZO has quit IRC
188 2017-09-15T08:29:20 <Cocodude> Youch, that seems like a lot of work
189 2017-09-15T08:29:32 <Cocodude> Honestly, I think what's been done here is too much handholding anyway (at the expensive of people like me).
190 2017-09-15T08:29:49 <Cocodude> If you're symlinking, you're doing something special anyway and should know what you're doing
191 2017-09-15T08:30:04 *** nodweber has quit IRC
192 2017-09-15T08:30:15 <Cocodude> Also, hashing wouldn't work - it would be reasonable to have the same, precise wallet on there twice
193 2017-09-15T08:30:25 <Cocodude> (just two physically different files, but the same contents)
194 2017-09-15T08:32:43 <Cocodude> Got a nice response at https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/10885
195 2017-09-15T08:33:50 <esotericnonsense> yeah, that's about in line with my expectation, that wallet.dat is not self contained
196 2017-09-15T08:34:06 <Cocodude> I'm a little confused though - what does it rely on that, say, a -rescan can't solve?
197 2017-09-15T08:34:07 <esotericnonsense> it's been a while since I looked at it
198 2017-09-15T08:37:17 *** Beef has quit IRC
199 2017-09-15T08:37:20 *** POJO has quit IRC
200 2017-09-15T08:38:21 <esotericnonsense> another 'supported' way unless you have very very limited storage would be to move everything and prune to the minimum, then you'd have about 4GB on SSD (plus wallet.dat) in total, though that breaks rescan
201 2017-09-15T08:38:34 <esotericnonsense> it's a tricky one
202 2017-09-15T08:38:43 <Cocodude> Yeah, I don't want to do that really, and like running a full node for altruistic reasons
203 2017-09-15T08:39:17 *** czaanja_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
204 2017-09-15T08:40:48 *** Beef has joined #bitcoin-dev
205 2017-09-15T08:49:16 *** cybrNaut has joined #bitcoin-dev
206 2017-09-15T08:50:33 <Cocodude> Now sipa is saying, "There are no dependencies between the wallet and the rest of the datadir, in either direction."
207 2017-09-15T08:50:46 *** cybrNaut has joined #bitcoin-dev
208 2017-09-15T08:50:49 <Cocodude> That's what I thought, but didn't sipa just say the opposite before?
209 2017-09-15T08:50:52 *** cybrNaut has quit IRC
210 2017-09-15T08:51:41 <esotericnonsense> wallet, not wallet.dat
211 2017-09-15T08:52:16 *** cybrNaut has joined #bitcoin-dev
212 2017-09-15T08:52:17 *** cybrNaut has quit IRC
213 2017-09-15T08:52:49 <esotericnonsense> bitcoin wiki is pretty out of date, but seems to claim that there's a database/ folder that stores bdb state
214 2017-09-15T08:53:19 <esotericnonsense> my nodes are running with disablewallet so don't have it here
215 2017-09-15T08:53:42 <Cocodude> Yikes, does that mean I should be backing that up too?
216 2017-09-15T08:54:11 <esotericnonsense> it only exists during runtime, so i expect that if there's a hard shutdown, that it'll be used for recovery
217 2017-09-15T08:54:39 <Cocodude> Indeed, which means it's probably best to store it in the same partition as the wallet.dat
218 2017-09-15T08:55:17 *** cybrNaut has joined #bitcoin-dev
219 2017-09-15T08:56:31 <arubi> that file has data like BDB2565 [4][397132] Non-transactional update, log type: 2, fileid: 1.
220 2017-09-15T08:56:31 <arubi> BDB2549 [4][397219] Checkpoint record, ckp_lsn: [4][397088], timestamp: Wed Sep 13 20:51:20 2017
221 2017-09-15T08:56:31 <arubi> . Total checkpoint: 4
222 2017-09-15T08:56:44 <esotericnonsense> by the way, it's great to see you guys are still running, feels like an eternity since I first saw you pop up :)
223 2017-09-15T08:57:15 <arubi> (yes looks like it's related to bdb and wallet.dat)
224 2017-09-15T08:57:23 <Cocodude> arubi: Sounds like it'll be quite I/O intensive too
225 2017-09-15T08:57:38 <arubi> that's right
226 2017-09-15T08:57:57 <arubi> I mean, I'm doing a couple of addnewaddress now and it's writing a lot of that ^^ each time
227 2017-09-15T08:58:21 <Cocodude> Is this the database folder?
228 2017-09-15T08:58:29 <arubi> yea, the 000000..log file
229 2017-09-15T08:59:02 <arubi> run `db_log_verify -c | less` (if you have db-utils)
230 2017-09-15T08:59:03 <Cocodude> Yeah. I guess a flush is when they's all put into the actual wallet.dat?
231 2017-09-15T08:59:16 <Cocodude> Nah, I just have the library here
232 2017-09-15T08:59:18 <wumpus> yes, the database/ folder has bdb state, it's compacted into wallet.dat extremely regularly so it will usually be empty
233 2017-09-15T08:59:37 <Cocodude> Cheers wumpus
234 2017-09-15T08:59:51 <Cocodude> I guess then, technically, it's a little safer to store that in the same place I'm storing the wallet.dat
235 2017-09-15T09:00:01 <wumpus> after a clean shutdown, there is no need to backup anything but wallet.dat
236 2017-09-15T09:00:05 <Cocodude> As if I want to recover from a hard crash, they're more likely to be in sync on the same parittion
237 2017-09-15T09:00:16 <wumpus> yes
238 2017-09-15T09:00:18 <Cocodude> Yeah, only talking about hard crash, and I'd probably consider using a backup anyway
239 2017-09-15T09:01:25 <Cocodude> wumpus: What's your take on my rant?
240 2017-09-15T09:01:28 <wumpus> what I usually do is place the "blocks" folder on another partition, sometimes "chainstate" too, and keep the rest together
241 2017-09-15T09:01:42 <Cocodude> Ooooh, so I'm not the only one doing crazy symlink stuff
242 2017-09-15T09:01:46 <wumpus> no
243 2017-09-15T09:01:49 *** rjak has joined #bitcoin-dev
244 2017-09-15T09:02:12 <Cocodude> wumpus: Do you think the symlink check is a good thing for wallet.dat or a bad thing?
245 2017-09-15T09:03:03 <wumpus> by far not, I do crazy hardlink stuff too, like https://gist.github.com/laanwj/3c4614a23e072cbb3d39090da1834a68
246 2017-09-15T09:03:37 <wumpus> what should it do if the wallet is a symlink?
247 2017-09-15T09:03:53 <Cocodude> It won't start, quite simply. There's a new check in there.
248 2017-09-15T09:03:55 <wumpus> probably just reject it, as all database state is expected to be in one directory by bdb
249 2017-09-15T09:04:00 <wumpus> oh that's good
250 2017-09-15T09:04:05 <Cocodude> Oh, I don't think it's good
251 2017-09-15T09:04:30 <Cocodude> If I symlinked both the database folder and wallet to a different partition, it would still error out
252 2017-09-15T09:04:39 <wumpus> bdb works with a database *directory*, where all databases need to be
253 2017-09-15T09:05:17 <esotericnonsense> so you'd basically want wallets/database and wallets/wallet.dat
254 2017-09-15T09:05:24 <Cocodude> Yes, just clicked
255 2017-09-15T09:05:35 <esotericnonsense> within the datadir or otherwise, and then this wallets directory could be symlinked off
256 2017-09-15T09:05:38 <wumpus> allowing symlinking would allow crazy things like linking multiple wallets from multiple partitions w/ multiwallet
257 2017-09-15T09:05:47 <wumpus> don't symlink bdb files
258 2017-09-15T09:05:57 <wumpus> could add a walletdir option that sets a different wallet database directory for the data directory, if you really need that
259 2017-09-15T09:06:05 <wumpus> s/for/from
260 2017-09-15T09:06:15 <Cocodude> Yes, that's what sipa is suggesting
261 2017-09-15T09:06:16 <wumpus> but all bdb files need to be together and not be symlinks
262 2017-09-15T09:07:00 <wumpus> ok, that's the way forward then
263 2017-09-15T09:07:33 <Cocodude> Sounds like the neatest way, but not a quick solution.
264 2017-09-15T09:17:34 <wumpus> doesn't sound particularly difficult or much work, but maybe I'm missing some subtlety
265 2017-09-15T09:18:00 <wumpus> the other option would be to symlink the *non-wallet* things as I do
266 2017-09-15T09:18:46 <Cocodude> Yeah, agreed it's an option, but a bit yucky.
267 2017-09-15T09:19:15 <wumpus> symlinking the wallet is yucky and brittle too
268 2017-09-15T09:19:25 <Cocodude> Agreed it doesn't sound too difficult really, but anything code-wise is likely to take some time to go into a stable release
269 2017-09-15T09:19:55 <Cocodude> It's a bit yucky, but it makes mores sense in terms of "I want this file secured, so I'll move it" rather than "I want this file secured, so I'll move everything but this file"
270 2017-09-15T09:20:38 <wumpus> that's all good in theory, but in practice bdb works with a database context directory, not a file, so it's really a directory that you need to secure
271 2017-09-15T09:21:00 <wumpus> e.g. your scheme falls apart if you have multiple wallets
272 2017-09-15T09:21:22 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
273 2017-09-15T09:21:24 <Cocodude> Yes, understood there. We're both agreeing that the wallet really should be its own directory.
274 2017-09-15T09:21:41 <wumpus> yes
275 2017-09-15T09:22:05 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
276 2017-09-15T09:32:42 *** POJO has joined #bitcoin-dev
277 2017-09-15T09:34:34 *** anon616 has quit IRC
278 2017-09-15T09:35:40 <Cocodude> Is there an enhancements tracker for Core?
279 2017-09-15T09:38:02 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
280 2017-09-15T09:46:14 *** Beef has quit IRC
281 2017-09-15T09:51:57 *** Beef has joined #bitcoin-dev
282 2017-09-15T09:57:11 *** anon616 has quit IRC
283 2017-09-15T09:59:16 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
284 2017-09-15T10:18:25 *** SopaXorzTaker has joined #bitcoin-dev
285 2017-09-15T10:32:36 *** damons is now known as damons-away
286 2017-09-15T10:34:50 *** RubenSomsen has joined #bitcoin-dev
287 2017-09-15T10:38:53 *** anon616 has quit IRC
288 2017-09-15T10:40:18 <wumpus> github issues?
289 2017-09-15T10:40:19 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
290 2017-09-15T10:40:44 <wumpus> or the release notes, for a summary per release
291 2017-09-15T10:42:53 *** anon616 has quit IRC
292 2017-09-15T10:43:15 <Cocodude> No, I mean to potentially raise the wallet directory as a new enhancement.
293 2017-09-15T10:43:18 <Cocodude> Not sure if github issues is the right place as the default contents talks about everything to do with bugs
294 2017-09-15T10:45:20 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
295 2017-09-15T10:51:33 *** anon616 has quit IRC
296 2017-09-15T10:53:15 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
297 2017-09-15T10:59:05 <wumpus> well you can certainly create an issue for an feature request, though the chance of someone picking it up is slim, unless another developer happens to have exactly the same need
298 2017-09-15T11:11:24 *** anon616 has quit IRC
299 2017-09-15T11:15:27 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
300 2017-09-15T11:16:45 *** anon616 has quit IRC
301 2017-09-15T11:19:55 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
302 2017-09-15T11:20:02 *** nowan has quit IRC
303 2017-09-15T11:24:20 *** nowan has joined #bitcoin-dev
304 2017-09-15T11:42:55 *** nodweber has joined #bitcoin-dev
305 2017-09-15T11:48:10 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-dev
306 2017-09-15T11:48:38 *** anon616 has quit IRC
307 2017-09-15T11:51:22 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
308 2017-09-15T12:00:19 *** Shaun3811 has joined #bitcoin-dev
309 2017-09-15T12:01:34 <Shaun3811> Hello
310 2017-09-15T12:05:28 *** mattcode has joined #bitcoin-dev
311 2017-09-15T12:06:54 *** airbreather_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
312 2017-09-15T12:09:05 *** airbreather has quit IRC
313 2017-09-15T12:11:14 *** anon616 has quit IRC
314 2017-09-15T12:12:47 <Shaun3811> chatty bunch then
315 2017-09-15T12:12:56 *** anon616 has joined #bitcoin-dev
316 2017-09-15T12:17:07 *** dabura667_ has quit IRC
317 2017-09-15T12:21:21 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has quit IRC
318 2017-09-15T12:24:59 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-dev
319 2017-09-15T12:44:10 *** nodweber has quit IRC
320 2017-09-15T12:44:34 *** belcher has joined #bitcoin-dev
321 2017-09-15T12:54:24 *** jtimon has joined #bitcoin-dev
322 2017-09-15T12:54:57 *** pergaminho has joined #bitcoin-dev
323 2017-09-15T12:58:35 *** dviola has joined #bitcoin-dev
324 2017-09-15T13:01:15 *** dviola has quit IRC
325 2017-09-15T13:01:18 *** CheckDavid has quit IRC
326 2017-09-15T13:11:43 *** pbase has quit IRC
327 2017-09-15T13:17:18 *** dermoth has joined #bitcoin-dev
328 2017-09-15T13:17:25 *** Shaun3811 has quit IRC
329 2017-09-15T13:33:52 *** damons-away is now known as damons
330 2017-09-15T13:39:06 *** iv3c has joined #bitcoin-dev
331 2017-09-15T13:40:43 *** iv3c has quit IRC
332 2017-09-15T13:40:48 *** justan0theruser has quit IRC
333 2017-09-15T13:41:05 *** iv3c has joined #bitcoin-dev
334 2017-09-15T13:43:03 *** BashCo_ has quit IRC
335 2017-09-15T13:47:12 *** pergaminho has quit IRC
336 2017-09-15T13:47:29 *** pergaminho has joined #bitcoin-dev
337 2017-09-15T13:52:24 *** Guyver2 has joined #bitcoin-dev
338 2017-09-15T13:59:16 *** BashCo has joined #bitcoin-dev
339 2017-09-15T14:02:19 *** bugs_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
340 2017-09-15T14:06:40 *** BashCo has quit IRC
341 2017-09-15T14:15:44 *** BashCo has joined #bitcoin-dev
342 2017-09-15T14:18:00 *** pbase has joined #bitcoin-dev
343 2017-09-15T14:22:57 *** BashCo has quit IRC
344 2017-09-15T14:24:01 *** cedenday has joined #bitcoin-dev
345 2017-09-15T14:24:27 *** BashCo has joined #bitcoin-dev
346 2017-09-15T14:27:10 *** Murch has joined #bitcoin-dev
347 2017-09-15T14:27:41 *** dakk has quit IRC
348 2017-09-15T14:48:01 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has quit IRC
349 2017-09-15T14:52:07 *** nazarewk has quit IRC
350 2017-09-15T14:53:03 <cedenday> Does anyone have more info on how SegWit is going to be supported in QT?
351 2017-09-15T14:53:55 *** sdaftuar has quit IRC
352 2017-09-15T14:55:17 <cedenday> IMO they should be default with some sort of flag disabling that behaviour.
353 2017-09-15T15:00:57 <wumpus> I don't think that's decided yet, there is nothing implementing that at least
354 2017-09-15T15:01:10 <wumpus> probably will be some setting
355 2017-09-15T15:01:15 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-dev
356 2017-09-15T15:04:02 *** czaanja_ has quit IRC
357 2017-09-15T15:22:01 *** dakk has joined #bitcoin-dev
358 2017-09-15T15:22:56 *** Dizzle has joined #bitcoin-dev
359 2017-09-15T15:24:48 *** Raziel has quit IRC
360 2017-09-15T15:30:40 *** Raziel has joined #bitcoin-dev
361 2017-09-15T15:31:27 *** dakk has quit IRC
362 2017-09-15T15:31:52 *** dakk has joined #bitcoin-dev
363 2017-09-15T15:35:40 *** CheckDavid has joined #bitcoin-dev
364 2017-09-15T15:37:52 *** jtimon has quit IRC
365 2017-09-15T15:39:07 *** PaulCapestany has quit IRC
366 2017-09-15T15:42:02 *** PaulCapestany has joined #bitcoin-dev
367 2017-09-15T15:46:51 *** Mottengrotte_ has quit IRC
368 2017-09-15T15:47:13 *** agricocb has quit IRC
369 2017-09-15T15:51:32 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has quit IRC
370 2017-09-15T15:54:17 *** damons has quit IRC
371 2017-09-15T15:55:31 *** cornfeedhobo has quit IRC
372 2017-09-15T15:55:31 *** Nothing4You has quit IRC
373 2017-09-15T15:55:56 *** cornfeedhobo has joined #bitcoin-dev
374 2017-09-15T15:57:21 *** Nothing4You has joined #bitcoin-dev
375 2017-09-15T15:59:26 *** damons has joined #bitcoin-dev
376 2017-09-15T16:03:33 *** agricocb has joined #bitcoin-dev
377 2017-09-15T16:04:19 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-dev
378 2017-09-15T16:04:19 *** agricocb has joined #bitcoin-dev
379 2017-09-15T16:05:49 *** licnep has joined #bitcoin-dev
380 2017-09-15T16:18:06 *** JackH has quit IRC
381 2017-09-15T16:37:22 *** meshcollider has quit IRC
382 2017-09-15T16:38:00 *** dviola has joined #bitcoin-dev
383 2017-09-15T16:50:08 *** damons has quit IRC
384 2017-09-15T16:51:37 *** damons has joined #bitcoin-dev
385 2017-09-15T16:56:22 *** iv3c has quit IRC
386 2017-09-15T16:56:44 *** iv3c has joined #bitcoin-dev
387 2017-09-15T17:04:09 *** one_zero has joined #bitcoin-dev
388 2017-09-15T17:06:36 *** cedenday has quit IRC
389 2017-09-15T17:07:48 *** chainey has quit IRC
390 2017-09-15T17:09:05 *** chainey has joined #bitcoin-dev
391 2017-09-15T17:10:56 *** POJO has quit IRC
392 2017-09-15T17:14:12 *** czaanja_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
393 2017-09-15T17:14:20 *** abpa has joined #bitcoin-dev
394 2017-09-15T17:14:30 *** atroxes has quit IRC
395 2017-09-15T17:15:48 *** atroxes has joined #bitcoin-dev
396 2017-09-15T17:17:06 *** dakk has quit IRC
397 2017-09-15T17:21:30 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has quit IRC
398 2017-09-15T17:24:22 *** dakk has joined #bitcoin-dev
399 2017-09-15T17:29:27 *** atroxes has quit IRC
400 2017-09-15T17:31:23 *** atroxes has joined #bitcoin-dev
401 2017-09-15T17:33:22 *** RubenSomsen has quit IRC
402 2017-09-15T17:35:53 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-dev
403 2017-09-15T17:39:28 *** raas has joined #bitcoin-dev
404 2017-09-15T17:41:17 *** SopaXorzTaker has quit IRC
405 2017-09-15T17:54:41 *** RubenSomsen has joined #bitcoin-dev
406 2017-09-15T18:01:39 *** Dizzle has quit IRC
407 2017-09-15T18:04:21 *** delinquentme has joined #bitcoin-dev
408 2017-09-15T18:08:25 *** adiabat has quit IRC
409 2017-09-15T18:08:37 *** adiabat has joined #bitcoin-dev
410 2017-09-15T18:09:35 *** Dizzle has joined #bitcoin-dev
411 2017-09-15T18:26:45 <esotericnonsense> Cocodude: see https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/11343
412 2017-09-15T18:27:39 <esotericnonsense> Cocodude: confirmation there that the database folder can store sensitive information if the wallet is unencrypted
413 2017-09-15T18:35:14 *** joeyy has quit IRC
414 2017-09-15T18:40:55 *** joeyy has joined #bitcoin-dev
415 2017-09-15T18:46:10 *** ongolaBoy has quit IRC
416 2017-09-15T18:46:17 *** RubenSomsen has quit IRC
417 2017-09-15T18:55:47 *** damons is now known as damons-away
418 2017-09-15T19:08:49 *** jtimon has joined #bitcoin-dev
419 2017-09-15T19:08:54 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has quit IRC
420 2017-09-15T19:13:24 *** agricocb has quit IRC
421 2017-09-15T19:21:45 *** joeyy has quit IRC
422 2017-09-15T19:22:48 *** joeyy has joined #bitcoin-dev
423 2017-09-15T19:22:57 *** pbase has quit IRC
424 2017-09-15T19:48:49 *** agricocb has joined #bitcoin-dev
425 2017-09-15T19:57:55 *** damons-away has quit IRC
426 2017-09-15T20:10:12 *** damons has joined #bitcoin-dev
427 2017-09-15T20:19:06 *** brianhoffman_ has quit IRC
428 2017-09-15T20:25:34 *** pergaminho has quit IRC
429 2017-09-15T20:38:20 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-dev
430 2017-09-15T21:03:48 *** moluccas has joined #bitcoin-dev
431 2017-09-15T21:04:12 *** moluccas has quit IRC
432 2017-09-15T21:09:41 *** meshcollider has joined #bitcoin-dev
433 2017-09-15T21:16:16 *** Pavle_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
434 2017-09-15T21:18:23 *** POJO has joined #bitcoin-dev
435 2017-09-15T21:21:20 *** brianhoffman_ has joined #bitcoin-dev
436 2017-09-15T21:21:45 *** Belxjander has quit IRC
437 2017-09-15T21:24:30 *** Belxjander has joined #bitcoin-dev
438 2017-09-15T21:25:03 *** Pavle_ has quit IRC
439 2017-09-15T21:29:12 *** raas has quit IRC
440 2017-09-15T21:32:39 *** bugs_ has quit IRC
441 2017-09-15T21:38:49 *** Pavle has joined #bitcoin-dev
442 2017-09-15T21:45:01 *** Pavle has quit IRC
443 2017-09-15T21:50:19 *** raas has joined #bitcoin-dev
444 2017-09-15T21:52:26 *** Guyver2 has quit IRC
445 2017-09-15T22:13:26 *** Dizzle has quit IRC
446 2017-09-15T22:13:52 *** delinquentme has quit IRC
447 2017-09-15T22:15:11 *** tknp has joined #bitcoin-dev
448 2017-09-15T22:24:25 *** delinquentme has joined #bitcoin-dev
449 2017-09-15T22:26:47 *** Chris_Stewart_5 has quit IRC
450 2017-09-15T22:33:57 *** mattcode has quit IRC
451 2017-09-15T22:44:20 *** CheckDavid has quit IRC
452 2017-09-15T22:53:21 *** takinbo has quit IRC
453 2017-09-15T23:07:54 *** damons is now known as damons-away
454 2017-09-15T23:09:49 *** takinbo has joined #bitcoin-dev
455 2017-09-15T23:19:21 *** meshcollider has quit IRC
456 2017-09-15T23:29:08 *** robink has quit IRC
457 2017-09-15T23:29:42 *** robink has joined #bitcoin-dev
458 2017-09-15T23:30:06 *** meshcollider has joined #bitcoin-dev
459 2017-09-15T23:55:24 *** tknp has quit IRC
460 2017-09-15T23:57:34 *** abpa has quit IRC
461 2017-09-15T23:58:07 *** justan0theruser has joined #bitcoin-dev