19:00:45 <wumpus> #startmeeting
19:00:45 <lightningbot> Meeting started Thu Dec  5 19:00:45 2019 UTC.  The chair is wumpus. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
19:00:45 <lightningbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
19:00:49 <emilengler> Hi
19:00:49 <fanquake> hi
19:00:51 <achow101> hi
19:00:54 <instagibbs> hi
19:00:57 <gleb> Hi
19:01:23 <wumpus> #bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: wumpus sipa gmaxwell jonasschnelli morcos luke-jr sdaftuar jtimon cfields petertodd kanzure bluematt instagibbs phantomcircuit codeshark michagogo marcofalke paveljanik NicolasDorier jl2012 achow101 meshcollider jnewbery maaku fanquake promag provoostenator aj Chris_Stewart_5 dongcarl gwillen jamesob ken281221 ryanofsky gleb moneyball kvaciral ariard digi_james amiti fjahr
19:01:25 <wumpus> jeremyrubin lightlike emilengler jonatack
19:01:32 <fjahr> Hi
19:01:38 <moneyball> hi
19:01:41 <meshcollider> hi
19:01:45 <warren> hi
19:01:54 <jamesob> hi
19:01:58 <sipa> hi
19:02:05 <wumpus> one proposed topic today in https://gist.github.com/moneyball/071d608fdae217c2a6d7c35955881d8a :  GUI CLI Arg test framework
19:02:06 <fanquake> Is that name list growing? Bunch of names I don't recognise
19:02:14 <digi_james> Hi
19:02:19 <wumpus> it's always growing
19:02:33 <wumpus> I tend to add everyone that has ever said anything in a meeting
19:02:46 <emilengler> Lol
19:02:48 <fanquake> append only
19:02:53 <jonatack> hi
19:02:59 <warren> short proposed topic: announcement of the new mailing list host, new process if you want new dev or announce lists
19:03:10 <jamesob> "short"
19:03:34 <wumpus> thanks, let's start with the usual
19:03:38 <emilengler> Ok
19:03:39 <wumpus> #topic High priority for review
19:03:59 <wumpus> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/projects/8  8 blockers, 6 chasing concept ACK
19:04:01 <gleb> I want to add #16702 if that’s possible.
19:04:03 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/16702 | p2p: supplying and using asmap to improve IP bucketing in addrman by naumenkogs · Pull Request #16702 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
19:04:19 <kanzure> hi
19:04:33 <nehan> [19:02:05] < wumpus> one proposed topic today in https://gist.github.com/moneyball/071d608fdae217c2a6d7c35955881d8a :  GUI CLI Arg test framework
19:04:45 <nehan> (oops, sorry).  also hi
19:04:51 <wumpus> hi!
19:04:58 <emilengler> Yeah I wanna talk about my proposed topic there^^
19:05:04 <emilengler> Would cover it now if it would be possible
19:05:11 <instagibbs> #17621 is a fix for the avoid_reuse leak, at least looking for concept ACKs
19:05:13 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/17621 | IsUsedDestination should count any known single-key address by instagibbs · Pull Request #17621 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
19:05:20 <instagibbs> (already on list)
19:06:00 <wumpus> added 16702
19:06:28 <wumpus> instagibbs: should it be under "chasing concept ACK" then instead of blockers?
19:06:34 <instagibbs> yeah actually
19:06:37 <gleb> Thank you!
19:07:01 <fanquake> Doesn't need to go on the list, but #17663 is going to be the base of a bunch of other PRs, if build system people want to take a look.
19:07:03 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/17663 | build: pass -dead_strip_dylibs to ld on macOS by fanquake · Pull Request #17663 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
19:07:59 <wumpus> escalating ever scarier linker argument names
19:08:27 <jamesob> hah
19:08:36 <fanquake> -Wl,-why_live has been getting some use today as well heh
19:08:54 <digi_james> lol
19:08:58 <wumpus> heh
19:09:00 <wumpus> #topic GUI CLI Arg test framework (emilengler)
19:09:10 <emilengler> Yes so let me first talk about it
19:09:46 <emilengler> I made a PR a few day ago "Add -guisettings" (Can someone post the id? I'm on my phone). Tests were suggested for it because it adds a cli paramter
19:10:08 <instagibbs> #17636
19:10:09 <emilengler> And there are Qt only cli parameters. I was wondering if it would be worth writing a test framework for qt args as well
19:10:10 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/17636 | qt: Add -guisettings option by emilengler · Pull Request #17636 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
19:10:15 <emilengler> If it is possile to test then
19:10:20 <emilengler> instagibbs: thanks
19:10:53 <wumpus> why is this a question? isn't testing things always good? what's the small print?
19:11:53 <emilengler> wumpus: Good question but it would be some effort und probably a bit maintaince as well and I don’t know if it is actually worth to make a new framework (or heavily extend the current one) just for one extra parameter
19:11:57 <wumpus> I guess GUI things are hard to test in general
19:12:16 <sipa> well what would it be testing?
19:12:23 <wumpus> like 'does the window start minimized' is not that easy to measure
19:12:28 <sipa> right
19:12:33 <emilengler> sipa: It would test if a file is created
19:12:40 <sipa> that sounds easy
19:12:52 <sipa> probably doesn't need much of a "framework" at all
19:12:59 <fanquake> ryanofsky would like to know your thoughts if you are here
19:13:03 <wumpus> that's just anbother functional test riight
19:13:07 <fanquake> Given you are doing the settings refactoring
19:13:10 <emilengler> wumpus: Maybe we could add an extra qt parameter which makes some stdout. This is then getting parsed
19:13:40 <emilengler> wumpus: IIRC the current functional test framework is bitcoind only
19:13:48 <wumpus> anyhow, yes, testing GUI arguments would be nice, some are more realitic for automatic testing than others
19:14:22 <emilengler> Yes, things like -splash are probably impossible to test
19:14:24 <wumpus> you can run the currrent functional tests w/ bitcoin-qt
19:14:32 <wumpus> but yes, that one would be bitcoin-qt only
19:15:15 <emilengler> Ok still thanks for the clarification :). Things I wanted to say are done. Someone wants to say something about it?
19:15:20 <emilengler> Otherwise this topic would be done
19:15:28 <wumpus> let's go to warren's topic then
19:15:36 <sipa> emilengler: i don't know what exactly you're asking
19:15:42 <wumpus> #topic announcement of the new mailing list host (warren)
19:15:51 <warren> I must express apologies for the unexpected timing of transition of lists.linuxfoundation.org to a new host. Dealing with this for the past years has been stressful, evaluated alternatives were all found to have drawbacks and communications between parties has been slow. Oddly enough by not changing we ended up with the best outcome. After a brief service disruption due to misconfiguration the lists were back online later that day. End
19:15:51 <warren> result:
19:15:59 <warren> - No change to list addresses or archive URL's.
19:15:59 <warren> - The new host is cooperative, communicative and will properly maintain the mailing list server.
19:16:06 <warren> - New dev or announce lists can now be requested. For example bitcoin-knots-announce was created. I will put a policy on a webpage somewhere but it will be roughly: "This list server is for only FOSS and strongly preferred to be pertaining to open common infrastructure, specifications or standards. If you want lists for a niche or commercial project you probably should instead use Google Groups or something."
19:16:13 <warren> I must thank the Linux Foundation for years of politically neutral hosting of dev lists, and now the Oregon State University Open Source Lab (OSUOSL) for continued vendor neutral hosting. The OSUOSL is well known since the early 2000's for infrastructure support for thousands of Open Source projects.
19:16:16 <warren> fin
19:16:17 <warren> next
19:16:27 <warren> unless people have questions, but this isn't really a dev topic so just FYI
19:16:34 <jamesob> thanks warren!
19:16:37 <sipa> thanks for the update
19:16:43 <emilengler> Thanks
19:16:45 <sipa> and for all the time it took to get there :)
19:16:47 <wumpus> thanks warren!
19:17:18 <wumpus> there was some talk of changing the bitcoin-core-dev mailing list to an announcement list
19:17:30 <wumpus> as, effectively, that's what it is
19:17:52 <sipa> is anyone on it?
19:18:23 <wumpus> I have no idea, if not, I can stop doing announcements there
19:18:24 <warren> I suppose that's a simple change. Also consider if dev would like special interest group dev lists or other announce lists.
19:19:03 <sipa> i think for non-mailinglist aliases we can use @bitcoincore.org fine
19:19:07 <warren> wumpus: I can ask for subscriber statistics, in any case it's helpful to keep posting to the same place because the archives are in a well known location that won't change anytime soon
19:19:36 <wumpus> there was vaguely some interest in it as announcement list, let me see if I can find the bitcoincore.org PR
19:19:55 <wumpus> https://github.com/bitcoin-core/bitcoincore.org/pull/648
19:20:10 <warren> In past years the mailing list host was not cooperative, that's different now so we can make changes like this.
19:20:31 <wumpus> at the least, we don't need a discussion mailing list for bitcoinc core, but a mailer for version and RC announcements is useful
19:20:42 <wumpus> (as well as archive)
19:21:00 <warren> one consideration is the archive URL is well known and linked from elsewhere so we'd need redirects if it renames
19:21:02 <wumpus> cool :)
19:22:06 <wumpus> we can discuss that outside the meeting
19:22:09 <wumpus> any other topics?
19:22:15 <jonatack> thanks warren. OSUOSL appears to be a great choice.
19:22:16 <ariard> hey can I get #16426 on hp?
19:22:19 <gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/16426 | Reverse cs_main, cs_wallet lock order and reduce cs_main locking by ariard · Pull Request #16426 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
19:22:25 <wumpus> ariard: you're too late !
19:22:30 <wumpus> no, ofc
19:22:43 <ariard> wumpus: sorry wasn't there
19:22:51 <ariard> it might be a slight IBD improvement
19:22:51 <emilengler> FYI: This was discussed in the PR club yesterday iirc
19:23:01 <wumpus> ariard: blockers or chasing concept?
19:23:06 <ariard> due to not locking cs_main in BlockConnected/BlockDisconnected
19:23:11 <ariard> it's ready it pass all tests
19:23:20 <ariard> and got already a lot of concept acks
19:23:46 <ariard> hard commit is only the top one, because you need to invert lock order at once
19:23:47 <wumpus> ok added
19:23:59 <ariard> but I can still split the PR if people feel it's too much at once
19:24:03 <wumpus> (to blockers, then)
19:24:08 <ariard> thnaks
19:24:56 <wumpus> that concludes the meeting, I think
19:25:11 <wumpus> #endmeeting